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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:13:53 UTC
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  • I see this discussion topic is off to a roaring start.

     

    How about I take EW's old seat and tell everyone to get on topic.

     

    -Tyler

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:18:07 UTC
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  • It makes sense if you look at the post before it. I'm not crazy...But yeah, it is getting off topic. Back on topic: Stereotypical villain character posted and ready to interact.

  • Edited on 2013-05-15 02:18:32 by ToaKapura1234
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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:42:25 UTC
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  • Hello, everyone, I'm back.

     

    I am taking bets on how long I'll stay back. For now I'm trying to continue my Caith and Aenarius arc, and hoping to get a few Matoran characters going.

     

    And wow, things have changed.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:44:48 UTC
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  • How about I take EW's old seat and tell everyone to get on topic.

     

    -Tyler

    Thank you, Lord Bolton. <3

     

    Also, just a reminder that if anyone in Ko-Koro has something to ask of Akiri Matoro, the meeting is in general session and he is taking requests/questions now. If you want to get involved in the Ko-Koro expansionist subplot, now is your chance.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:47:21 UTC
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  • Hello, everyone, I'm back.

     

    I am taking bets on how long I'll stay back. For now I'm trying to continue my Caith and Aenarius arc, and hoping to get a few Matoran characters going.

     

    And wow, things have changed.

    Like the Mahiki being removed from the Approved Masks List? :P

     

    Anyhow, finally got my profiles up for this year. I trimmed out the unnecessary ones, and am gonna try and add a few more now that I have the time for a full year's character arc.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:49:57 UTC
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  • This is why I need to do things at a time earlier than 10:30. I actually saw the note about the changed lists, but went to the rule index instead of the profile topic...

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:53:15 UTC
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  • Don't worry about it; the damage was nonexistent and elementary. Good to see you back! But let's move on now.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 02:55:11 UTC
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  • Welcome back Zaranya.

     

    Now then, guys, what has occurred since the return of the forums?

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 05:58:24 UTC
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  • Welcome back Zaranya.

     

    Now then, guys, what has occurred since the return of the forums?

    New characters having great debut's and older characters still going strong.

     

    Speaking of new characters, can I have them temporarily 'not have a mask'? As in, they have one, but I haven't made up my mind (More specifically, haven't got any PM back) but still wanna start up on them?

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 06:10:55 UTC
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  • So as of tomorrow, I will be taking a trip to Disney Land until the following Monday.Upon my return however, there shall be a couple plans with Le-Koro that I'd like to set into motion soon. More details later.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 06:14:09 UTC
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  • So as of tomorrow, I will be taking a trip to Disney Land until the following Monday.Upon my return however, there shall be a couple plans with Le-Koro that I'd like to set into motion soon. More details later.

    Lucky! Have fun! Make sure the plan is great! Now I wanna hear it.

     

    I wouldn't be surprised if a theme park was built. People would actually go to Le-Wahi.....meaning it is a good financial decision and enterprise.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 06:43:53 UTC
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  • Well, thank goodness, the forums are back! Anyway, I'd like to thank every player who expressed their support for the Lesterin species - "back by popular demand" is very apt here and the Lesterin couldn't have come back without you :)

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 06:58:09 UTC
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  • Most probably supported it because Lohkar is awesome.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 07:02:33 UTC
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  • Most probably supported it because Lohkar is awesome.

    And not just because he was based on CJS but because he developed into an awesome guy who had stashes of rum. Anyways if Lohkar is back so too is one of my characters!

  • Edited on 2013-05-15 07:03:47 by JL v2
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  • Posted 2013-05-15 07:13:19 UTC
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  • I just really liked 'em as a species myself. They coincided beautifully with a powerless Toa-sized species I'd made up myself. The advanced matoran-esque abilties provided the knockout punch.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 07:43:57 UTC
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  • I've had a change of heart.

     

    I feel like a politician to be saying this, but my position on custom traits has, over the past few days, evolved. After consulting with my fellow staff, weighing the opinions of some storytellers who I greatly respect, and sensing general discontent from the player base - the last kind of feeling I want to exist in what's supposed to be a fun game - regarding my recent approval strictness, I've decided to be more lenient in approving custom powers, masks, species, and elements. If you have a custom power, mask, species, or element that was just denied, please feel free to run it by me again, and I will review it with a more generous eye. The profiles topic and the first post of this topic have been edited to reflect the changes - or, really, the lack of changes - in the rules. Several staff stances on custom approvals have reverted to where they were last year. Custom powers, masks, species and powers are fair game to be approved again.

     

    Let me justify my prior actions - the rampant, probably cruel-seeming, denials - before explaining my current position, and preface what will follow by noting that my past misgivings regarding custom powers are still pertinent to a degree, and still weigh on me as I re-open the field. My worry has always been that superficial customizations distract players from focusing on the actual character of their characters. People will tend to think of their abnormal characters as "my black-fire Toa" or "my Mark Bearer" rather than "my person with the internal scars" or "my guy torn by competing urges." It makes sense that people fixate on unusual power sets in a world already full of superheroes, but this is something I think should be avoided. Because my goal as a Game Master is to enhance the meaningfulness of characters and character interaction, I've always therefore tended to see custom traits as detrimental. My perceived link between custom abilities and inferior character should be explored.

     

    It's never been a secret that I have a general aversion to custom species and most other custom abilities. This prejudice, I believe, can be traced to my earlier days in the BZPRPG, when I suppose I subconsciously associated unique powers with cardboard personae for the first time. To say that characters back then weren't as regulated as they are today would be... a huge understatement; any of you who also played in that era, during the last few arcs of the first BZPRPG, can certainly attest to the great and dangerous liberty that was in the hands of the players. Nothing ever had to be approved; you could do essentially whatever you wanted; and, disregarding the daily chaos of the game and the ill feeling between the players at that time, the characters of that age were bland and typical, more like video game avatars with juiced-up power sets than literary characters. My experiences playing as a part of a world of characters more defined by their strength than by their personalities affected me; the experiences of my past have colored my perceptions of the present.

     

    Back then, the "game" of the BZPRPG was to push the limits of legality as far as was possible; somebody who exploited loopholes to give their character more clout was seen as admirable. When I was a normal player in this era, I was just as much a part of this culture as anyone. It was only really once I'd ascended to staff that I was able to gain some perspective on the culture and decide that, considering the nature of players at the time - sharp and sneaky, resistant to regulation - a drastic tightening of staff power needed to happen for the sake of fairness, if nothing else. I helped convince Friar Tuck of this in time for the pre-Dataclysm BZPRPG reboot, and together we started putting down the first restrictions on character powers and the like. By the time we reached our current iteration, the regulations were even higher. My mindset was always to constrain more, regulate more; I was used to dealing with a player base that was generally uncooperative, and would sniff out any opportunities to circumvent the rules and get ahead.

     

    I don't know when or why it happened, but the timbre of players in the game changed over the course of last arc. People became more responsible, more respectful, more capable. Posts became longer, and characters became known more for their personalities than their power sets. Until now, I haven't really noticed how far we've come in the right direction; I was always too preoccupied with finishing some post or another to step back and see the big picture, but now I'm doing just that. You all are a remarkable group, to be honest - there's been an unexpected, quite welcome renaissance of the BZPRPG, defined by better, more character-focused storytelling. Reprimands are few and far between; you guys have done nothing wrong.

     

    So why, so many of you pointed out, did I feel the need to punish you?

     

    I hadn't thought of my denials as punishments, though of course they must have seemed like it. From my perspective, the start of the new arc was an opportunity to pull the game further towards order, regulation. It was a chance to eliminate most of those custom angles I had always though of as the enemy of character development. Unless a custom species could totally sell me on the otherwise-unachievable character development opportunities it'd give players (a difficult question under any circumstances), I resolved not to approve it; I am, of course, a very hard sale, especially in that department. I plowed on through my stack of approvals, happy to be proactively fighting the problems I'd seen so often in the past. On the other hand, the responsible, experienced players whose custom abilities I was denying - custom masks, powers and species that'd been played perfectly reasonably last arc - felt robbed of their fairly-earned, never-abused toys. That wasn't a fair deal, and it wasn't even justified under the circumstances of the game today. It never occurred to me to think less about what was being asked to be approved than about the player that was asking.

     

    By shutting down so many approvals and stiffening the regulations on custom powers, I hindered creativity and made the game grim, all in the name of vanquishing a non-issue; for that, I'm shameful. A key part of this game, what drew me - and likely, many of you - to the BZPRPG in the first place, is the creativity inherent in its sandbox environment. To have denied so many of your ideas in the approval stage was counter-creative, the opposite of what anyone wants. For the game to run enjoyably, a balance needs to be struck between order and creativity. In this case, I overbalanced the side of order, which hurt the potential for creativity. I hope that looking at custom abilities with greater leniency will help to rectify the imbalance.

     

    Last arc was excellent; the system worked almost perfectly, and custom game elements that were approved were not noticeably abused. I have been blind to the progress this game has made of late, and I hope you will forgive me for having pursued what I, in my closed perspective, thought was right. I'd also like to thank everyone who was willing to confront me about this issue; I appreciate community feedback especially when it's negative, because such commentary lets me know what needs changing.

     

    If it ain't broke, I figure, there's no need to fix it. The game hasn't broken yet - I've never been as proud of it, in fact - so trying to fix it was just a silly thing of me to do. :)

  • Edited on 2013-05-15 07:44:32 by Nuju Metru
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  • Posted 2013-05-15 08:10:24 UTC
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  • *briefly considers turning Zeal back to Kinetics by way of quick retcon*I think I might have to uncharacteristically pass on this opportunity, actually. I kind of like Zeal as he is now, he really did need some character development, anyway.Public Opinion Time: Do you think a Toa of Kinetics would fit in this current version of Mata Nui like he did the last? Or should he stay how he is?

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 08:17:10 UTC
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  • His powers haven't really influenced his character too much, so I'm pretty indifferent to whether you want to change him back or not.

     

    I'm really more concentrating on the fact that there is a higher chance that Uyism can come back from the dead her coma.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 08:19:28 UTC
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  • Well, I must say I did like Zealokan the toa of kinetics, though that's not to say I might not grow to like Zeal the toa of fire as well. It may just be nostalgia talking, but I would change him back. Having such unique abilities and being the last of his kind made him an interesting character to read about and RP with. Yes, he has more angst now, but it's not like he lacked that before.

     

    I suppose in the end it comes down to where you want to take his character: heaping on more loss and pain or trying to have him deal with what he had already amassed.

     

    Ooh, and something I've just thought of - with all the new machinery popping up, powers of kinetic energy could be rreally useful in running them and/or opening up new possibilities.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 10:37:54 UTC
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  • Hmmm. It's understandable; I was taught by the people here that what makes a good RP isn't great powers but great characters. Still, I've seen great characters develop to their point with much of their help stemming from powers that they have.

     

     

     

     

    Resubmission Resent!

     

    Also, Kinetics would be moreso useful now that there's....more 'cargo transport' around the villages.

  • Edited on 2013-05-15 11:15:42 by JL v2
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  • Posted 2013-05-15 10:37:55 UTC
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  • Aaron <3

     

    Also, the Dorian Shaddix plot arc for this go-around begins soon. Just fair warning. c:

     

    -Tyler

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 10:43:41 UTC
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  • Nuju, I approve most wholeheartedly of everything you have just said.

    -Dovydas

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 11:00:13 UTC
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  • While I understand the reasoning, I kind of liked the restrictions. Oh well.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 11:14:35 UTC
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  • Aaron <3

     

    Also, the Dorian Shaddix plot arc for this go-around begins soon. Just fair warning. c:

     

    -Tyler

    Will he be killing us or helping stop us from dying - or better, standing the equilibrium between both?

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 11:16:32 UTC
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  • You'll be surprised.

     

    -Tyler

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 11:20:53 UTC
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  • Oh dear.

     

    I don't like surprises.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 12:07:33 UTC
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  • Let me justify my prior actions - the rampant, probably cruel-seeming, denials - before explaining my current position, and preface what will follow by noting that my past misgivings regarding custom powers are still pertinent to a degree, and still weigh on me as I re-open the field. My worry has always been that superficial customizations distract players from focusing on the actual character of their characters. People will tend to think of their abnormal characters as "my black-fire Toa" or "my Mark Bearer" rather than "my person with the internal scars" or "my guy torn by competing urges." It makes sense that people fixate on unusual power sets in a world already full of superheroes, but this is something I think should be avoided. Because my goal as a Game Master is to enhance the meaningfulness of characters and character interaction, I've always therefore tended to see custom traits as detrimental. My perceived link between custom abilities and inferior character should be explored.

    I was perfectly fine with custom powers and Kanohi being a bit harder to approve - the only character who was really overly affected by it (besides that one in the Living Kanohi plot) had a logical, non-retcon explanation for it ready (which, to be honest, I might keep in a modified form - gives the character the non-monetary motivation I was looking for).In my experience, giving people too much freedom will for many lead to neglecting their actual characters (with a few memorable exceptions). On the flip side, giving people too little freedom feels a bit confining, as you've said here, and can get accusations about "being more like a game than a role play." I think you've managed the line extremely well lately, and really deserve a round of applause yourself for all the hard work you've put into making this RPG the best RPG possible. ...To me, at least, that looked to take a lot of guts. Nuju's probably the best GM I've had the chance to write under - I can only imagine how he manages all the approval PMs he gets, especially at the beginning of a new arc. :P---On an unrelated note: could someone in the Horsemen plot please PM me with our current progress? I kinda let it fall to the wayside for a time, but I'm about ready to get back into it now that the plot may start soon.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 12:22:29 UTC
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  • Well this is really ironic. I've been so anxious for BZP to be back up, but not that it IS back up I'm out of ideas for what to do with my character.Oh irony, why must you prey upon my life so?

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 12:31:42 UTC
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  • Well you could find somebody to interact with and build from there.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 12:42:16 UTC
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  • *Looks at what everyone's doing in Ga-Koro; everyone's basically preoccupied or on the other side of the wahi**Looks at Voutok who is on Sentry duty as a Marine*Yeah, wish me luck on that XD I guess I'll just wait it out.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 13:19:26 UTC
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  • *insert Nuju's long post here because I don't want to clutter the topic with an overly long quotation*

     

    Nuju, if anything, you just gained standing in my eyes. It's a lot harder to admit when you feel you crossed your own line than it is to merely quietly make the change, and go on as usual. And you're a good GM for doing it.

     

    And I agree with a lot of what you said. The original BZPRPG was nigh on chaos at times, and that kind of unregulated customization would be Karzahni. But I also agree that you and Tuck managed to strike a good balance last year,allowing for it, whilst still regulating.Good on you for both counts. :)

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 13:27:04 UTC
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  • The Old BZPRPG was terrible.

     

    Didn't we purify a character by holding hands in a circle with space-magic?

     

    Or is my memory failing?

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 13:29:15 UTC
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  • The Old BZPRPG was terrible.

     

    Didn't we purify a character by holding hands in a circle with space-magic?

     

    Or is my memory failing?

     

    That sounds awesome.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 13:32:22 UTC
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  • Looking at Nuju's post, I completely understand why the rules were increased. It held back the customization to keep the rules in place. I have seen before, in the last reboot, what happens when customized creations are used to exploit the game, such as masks being used in ways that only vaguely fit their descriptions, or species that really seem designed to break the balance of the game.

     

    While at first I was a little disappointed by not having the Avians return, being able to have Vrana as a Toa has really given me a whole new opportunity. Before, Vrana struggled against the island, and how he didn't truly fit. Now he's trapped inside an alien form, his beloved wings vanished, the only thing keeping him from breaking down entirely is the elemental powers he gained, and even he can't use those hold himself at bay for too long.

     

    Basically, I think turning Vrana into a Toa might actually have turned out to be a really good thing, and give me a whole new set of possibilities for his story.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 13:51:17 UTC
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  • The Old BZPRPG was terrible.

     

    tumblr_m6tac8haeM1r3gs9qo1_500.gif

     

    The old BZPRPG, when at its prime, was almost all custom content. And it was pretty awe-inspiring. That said, a huge part of the reason it held together was because pretty much everyone involved was fairly experienced (well, probably bar me, but I spent the entire time wanting to be Seraphim and so was unlikely to put a foot wrong) and knew where the line was. I think, with the current numbers of new-ish players, that reintroducing that level of custom content would result in sheer chaos.

     

    I was actually quite looking forward to playing in an almost-pure-canon setting again. That said, I think Nuju has made some very good calls. I haven't very much experience playing under him as GM, but he just earned a big chunk of respect from me for being so willing to second-guess his own opinion.

     

    I think we all need to be very careful about whether we use custom content for a story-based perspective, or purely because you think it would be super-duper-cool. Having looked at the Lesterin, I rather like that they're not so very different from Toa - they seem to have been created purely as a role-playing enhancement, and I appreciate that a not unreasonably large bit.

     

     

    disregarding the daily chaos of the game and the ill feeling between the players at that time, the characters of that age were bland and typical, more like video game avatars with juiced-up power sets than literary characters.

    Back then, the "game" of the BZPRPG was to push the limits of legality as far as was possible; somebody who exploited loopholes to give their character more clout was seen as admirable.

    ...however. I'm not entirely sure which bit of the game Nuju is referring to, as this isn't the BZPRPG I remember. Perhaps this is in reference to the Abeo/Derrum arc, as I was mostly busy wrapping up Metru-Nui at that point. I certainly don't remember much, if any, ill feeling between players, bland characters or boundary pushers.

     

    I don't know who these quotes, amongst others, are directed towards, nor I am I quite sure how to take them. I'm sure no offence was meant, and of course none is taken. Regardless, that time is long gone and there's little point getting offended or arguing over this. My thanks go to the staff for all they've done so far; I've only been back for a few days and I'm having a whale of a time. See y'all on Mata-Nui. :)

  • Edited on 2013-05-15 13:57:39 by Tahakki
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  • Posted 2013-05-15 14:07:36 UTC
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  • By terrible I was referring to the fact that pretty much anything could happen.

     

    I loved my giant airship in Derrum, and I liked it overall.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 14:08:40 UTC
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  • NEX has arrived, and the second phase of a dark plan begins.

     

    Everyone must de. If anyone would like to take part in this deadly scheme, merely send me a message. Everyone must die.

     

    Join us and kill them. Anyone who already had a previous NEX character, feel free to have them arrive on the scene. Join us and kill them.

     

    We await your bloodshed. I can't wait to finally get NEX in motion. We await your bloodshed.

  • Edited on 2013-05-15 14:10:08 by The Dark Chronicler
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  • Posted 2013-05-15 14:47:42 UTC
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  • *briefly considers turning Zeal back to Kinetics by way of quick retcon*I think I might have to uncharacteristically pass on this opportunity, actually. I kind of like Zeal as he is now, he really did need some character development, anyway.Public Opinion Time: Do you think a Toa of Kinetics would fit in this current version of Mata Nui like he did the last? Or should he stay how he is?

     

    I was the one that actually I shot down. I don't remember which one of us approved it, but this is one power I do not want in the game.

     

    Tuck saying outright no? Unusual, yes, but I have my reasons ;) Sorry, but it'll be clear later.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 15:29:13 UTC
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  • Attention folks

     

    We have a new player called Phantom Terror. Now someone might have noticed that he's started RPing without making a profile to go with it. I encourage you all to be as accepting and helpful as you can. I've taken the trouble of already advising him to read the rules and whatnot.

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  • Posted 2013-05-15 16:02:20 UTC
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  •  

    Attention folks

    We have a new player called Phantom Terror. Now someone might have noticed that he's started RPing without making a profile to go with it. I encourage you all to be as accepting and helpful as you can. I've taken the trouble of already advising him to read the rules and whatnot.

     

    You know what? I decided I have more respect for you after this. Thank you for taking the initiative.

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